"Is it fun being gun death capital of the world? Well, you've got to shed the blood of a few patriots to keep that 2nd amendment oiled."
Kid, CRIMINALS are the ones shedding blood here. The majority of gun deaths are criminals-on-criminals. And I suppose you consider them patriots as well?
No matter, we'll look into the lack of sense that you and PotatoError seem to have.
"Sure, kids in other countries with guns aplenty don't go around mowing down their class mates with automatic weapons but this is because their society isn't fucked up."
There has never been an incident where a kid used an automatic weapon (machine gun) in a shooting.
Evidnetly, however, you seem to have forgotten about an incident in Brazil in which a college student went blazing away in a mall with a G3 assault rifle (Brazil having strict gun control). We've never had that sort of thing.
"In America can civilians carry guns on the street? No, hardly ever. So if armed robbers burst into a bank lobby and there are 30 people in there are any of them armed? No, so whats all this rubbish about civilians being able to protect themselves?"
Which is why conceal carry permits on a shall-issue basis are a good thing. Vermont has started implementing such laws (many people carry handguns there), and their gun crime went way DOWN. A law enforcement official from some county in Vermont actually cited the conceal carry permits as being responsible, and gave examples of citizens capturing criminals, including one attempted bank robbery incident.
"But have you thought about the lunatics? Arguments happen all the time, some people just can't deal with arguments and lose it."
Arguments usually happen at home. Besides, we don't have an abundance of arguments turning into shootouts.
Again, do you realize how few legal gun owners in America will misuse their guns? 90-95% of people who use a gun to kill somebody are criminals (in that they have an adult criminal record). They don't own guns legally.
"But give everyone a gun and you can be guaranteed that thousands of people will die every year from unplanned shootings bought on in sudden anger."
Really? There are lots of guns around here now, and that doesn't seem to be happening, last time I checked.
"But if you put a deadly killing tool in these peoples hands you can guarantee people will start dying."
Again, very few legal gun owners do that. You don't seem to realize how little that happens. Maybe you should get your head of all the media propoganda in which you are indulged and pay attention to what's really going on.
"The criminal will always get the first shot in. Maybe they will only take down one other person before they are taken out by another civilian, maybe they will get more."
Not all criminals carry guns. Say a mugger attacks a person with a knife, and the person (who has a conceal carry permit) draws a handgun and points it at him. The mugger drops his knife and runs off. These sorts of criminals don't usually use guns. However, even if they do, you seem to believe that criminals immediately shoot to kill when they first see a victim. Not usually...they usually point their gun, demand money, take it, and run. Say a criminal (who isn't expecting the person to be armed) demands their money and starts to run off. The moment he turns his back, the person draws a gun and shouts at him to freeze (maybe fires a WARNING shot), and then he has to surrender.
"If everyone has guns and one maniac is in the middle of a crowd and shoots someone, what happens? Panic, followed by a dozen people drawing their firearms and firing at the aggressor. How many of these people will miss? How will people know that none of these people are accomplises? Surely an all out shootout is going to occur - much like how a brawl starts. The crowd would literally shoot itself. Hundreds could die. That's why everyone should NOT be able to own guns."
Again, this has never happened. Show me an incident where it has. I can give numerous instances in which several people in a crowd used guns to stop criminals, and no innocent bystanders were killed.
Here are some facts about the 2.5 million gun defenses every year:
-In 83.5% of successful gun defenses, the attacker either threatened or used force first - disproving the myth that having a gun available for defense wouldn't make any difference.
-In 91.7% of these incidents the defensive use of a gun did not wound or kill the criminal attacker (and the gun defense wouldn't be called "newsworthy" by newspaper or TV news editors). In 64.2% of these gun-defense cases, the police learned of the defense, which means that the media could also find out and report on them if they chose to.
-In 73.4% of these gun-defense incidents, the attacker was a stranger to the intended victim. (Defenses against a family member or intimate were rare -- well under 10%.) This disproves the myth that a gun kept for defense will most likely be used against a family member or someone you love.
-In over half of these gun defense incidents, the defender was facing two or more attackers -- and three or more attackers in over a quarter of these cases. (No means of defense other than a firearm -- martial arts, pepper spray, or stun guns -- gives a potential victim a decent chance of getting away uninjured when facing multiple attackers.)
"I have a bunch of wires, ICs, resistors, capacitors and a soldering iron. It doesn't mean I can make a Pentium 4."
Once again, Because It Isn't proves what an ignorant child he is.
Wow, good comparison, isn't it? You have no idea how easy it is to do. Did you not pay attention to the photograph I posted? Of the peasant gun maker building AK47s' from scratch? You have no idea how easy it is to make a gun compared to a CPU. Go ask the WDC police about the homemade guns they keep finding in criminal hands.
"Look, I've had it with you. You are completely stupid. Yes, there has been an increase in violent crime using guns. There has been an even LARGER increase in violent crime not involving guns, i.e. THE GENERAL INCREASE IN VIOLENT CRIMES HAS BROUGHT UP THE GUN CRIME RATE."
NO FUCKING SHIT, SHERLOCK!!! YOU MISSED THE FUCKING POINT!!!
My point was simply that the handgun ban didn't lower gun violence. I didn't say it actually <I>caused</I> the violence to go up. Just that it didn't stop it.
Wow, learn to read, kid. Maybe I can give you a hook-up to a local elementary school tutor?
"You like statistics? Here's some 1998 statistics for gun death rates across countries:
USA: 14.24 (deaths per 100,000)
England & Wales: 0.41"
Yeah, I like statistics. Like these:
Switzerland (low gun control): .44 (deaths per 100,000)
Jamaica (guns prohibited): 36.8 per 100,000
Brazil (guns heavily restricted): 25.78 per 100,000
Also, interestingly enough, England's gun homicide rate was less than .1 back in 1910. At that time, guns were readily available to everyone. Now, with strict gun control, it is more than 5 times that. What? You were saying how no guns = no gun murders?